Discussion Forum - Northstar Chevelle Club

frank · Active Member

teaching myself to weld

bowtie · Secretary

So I have approximately 30 seconds experience before yesterday. I know the general idea, mostly it's the machine setup that has given me some issues this weekend. Here's what I have run across and learned:

1-I guessed too light on power output so it just did the hot glue gun thing on top and not actually weld. The welder is a Matco which only has a #1 and #2 setting, then you also have a min or max switch for those, plus wire speed. I'm using a tank for gas shielding.

2-Clean the metal, even if it looks clean hit it with a wire brush to make my life easier.

3-Angle grinders with sutting and grinding discs are like erasers.

4-After using those, hit it with the wire wheel again.

5-DO NOT forget to swap the clear face shield for your welding helmet. I got an auto-darkening helmet from Enga, works great. In fact, I got so used to having it down and looking around that when I had my clear faceshield on, I forgot and lit up some metal. Yeah, can't miss that bright blue-ish/purplish light. All is good, and I won't be forgetting to do that again. Ever.

Pics to follow sometime on my progress. It's fun. Glad this is only some stake pockets on a utility trailer and not my car. Now I have to start nabbing scrap from the junk pile at work for more practice.

Lost in the 60s · President

bowtie wrote:
5-DO NOT forget to swap the clear face shield for your welding helmet. I got an auto-darkening helmet from Enga, works great. In fact, I got so used to having it down and looking around that when I had my clear faceshield on, I forgot and lit up some metal. Yeah, can't miss that bright blue-ish/purplish light. All is good, and I won't be forgetting to do that again. Ever.
Pics to follow sometime on my progress. It's fun. Glad this is only some stake pockets on a utility trailer and not my car. Now I have to start nabbing scrap from the junk pile at work for more practice.
Yes, you will................just give it some time...
Practicing on scrap is a good way to learn and better than practicing on your actual project. 4 heat settings isn't much control. It may take a bit more prcatice to find the right setting.

John D · 2K+ Club

Another few tips:

- Avoid the wire wheel. Believe it or not the breakdown of the wires will contaminate the "field". Use a grinding or sanding disc to clean the metal.
- After grinding/sanding/cleaning wipe the "field" and parts with acetone to remove all oils or contaminants.
- As nice as it will be, avoid using a fan in your welding area. It will blow the shielding gas out of the weld field.
- Wear leather boots or shoes! (You'd never believe how fast a drip will melt through tennis shoes!)
- Invest in the following equipment:
Dedicated ABC fire extinguisher - bolt it to your welding rig.
"Leathers". Just the upper sleeves & chest rig. Sunburn isn't cool. (at a minimum a heavy "denim" long-sleeve work shirt)
Good fitting leather gloves (gauntlet style).
A couple of the magnetic 90/45 degree jig things.
A couple of "open frame" vise-grip clamps (4" or better throat).

Dave Seitz · Mega Poster

Gas plays a BIG PART in how you weld. A mix gas will help so much over a single gas. See your local welding store and ask what they have for you.
Flux wire is great if your a hack and do not care about quality of work. Flux is designed for outdoor, construction, farm equipment, and windy areas. Seminars in the past it was stated that flux core will leave a contaminated weld area under paint. They advise grind/clean/blast welds for best adhesion of top coat.

John D · 2K+ Club

Agree on the 1/4" "stick-out" - it's just a matter of practice.

Depending on the make of gun, I've seen shielding collars that look like a castle-nut for doing spot welds. You put the tip flat down on the work and pull the trigger... or maybe those were for a dedicated spot weld rig?

Another tool investment - a dedicated pair of diagonals/dikes/side cutters. These stay on the welding cart - so you're not searching around for them to snip off the foot & a half of wire that spews out when you set the gun down on something and hits the trigger

Mitch - check Toll Welding. They have some cool welding gloves - I think they're made of pigskin or something. They are thin and fit well - you really don't lose much "feel". (I've got big "square" palms, and short fingers, and finding good fitting gloves is a pain).

Another investment: Performance Welding by Richard Finch. I was pretty good before, and this guy's tips made me better.

bowtie · Secretary

John D wrote:
Another few tips:

- Avoid the wire wheel. Believe it or not the breakdown of the wires will contaminate the "field". Use a grinding or sanding disc to clean the metal. NOTED
- After grinding/sanding/cleaning wipe the "field" and parts with acetone to remove all oils or contaminants. ALSO NOTED
- As nice as it will be, avoid using a fan in your welding area. It will blow the shielding gas out of the weld field. Didn't have a fan on, have heard before about the fan thing before.
- Wear leather boots or shoes! (You'd never believe how fast a drip will melt through tennis shoes!) don't have any but I was really careful....
- Invest in the following equipment:
Dedicated ABC fire extinguisher - bolt it to your welding rig. Had one within arm's reach, have 2 in the garage near each door.
"Leathers". Just the upper sleeves & chest rig. Sunburn isn't cool. (at a minimum a heavy "denim" long-sleeve work shirt) Wore my work jacket from the uniform company
Good fitting leather gloves (gauntlet style). Got 'em.
A couple of the magnetic 90/45 degree jig things. Got 'em, used a vice clamp instead for this project but I did use them for practice.
A couple of "open frame" vise-grip clamps (4" or better throat). On the "to buy" list, eventually.

Lost in the 60s · President

I can't work with those thick welding gloves. I need more feel and flex in my fingers. I buy unlined leather gloves with as long a cuff as I can get at Fleet Farm or Menards for $10. They usually last 2-3 weeks wearing them most of the day and handling sheetmetal. I have "removed" the end of the fingers with a sanding disc a couple times.

bowtie · Secretary

Questions:
about 1/2" or so wire coming from end of gun OK or should it be more?

I saw a video where the guy was resting the tip on the material (at an angle) for a spot weld, is that OK?

Thanks for everyone's ti[s and feedback, any other actual skill tips you guys have? I found a good website with some videos and stuff which I will go through more thoroughly when I get a chance.

Tim H · Mega Poster

1/2" is ok but if you get to far out you lose the shielding gas. I started welding by "walking the cup" but in time you learn to just hold it back a bit. If you are going to cap your weld with another bead and you have perosity(?) in the weld then grind it down to a nice finish. If you're doing fillet welds a V shape is always best to get the weld with maximum penetration. Getting the root pass in properlyon a multi pass weld is real important.

I generally don't wear gloves with a MIG so the feel is there but that probably isn't the smartest thing to do. And I have dropped weld slag into my tennis shoes. It takes weeks to heal.

Lost in the 60s · President

bowtie wrote:
Questions:
about 1/2" or so wire coming from end of gun OK or should it be more?

I saw a video where the guy was resting the tip on the material (at an angle) for a spot weld, is that OK?

Thanks for everyone's ti[s and feedback, any other actual skill tips you guys have? I found a good website with some videos and stuff which I will go through more thoroughly when I get a chance.
The tip is electrically charged too as part of the "field" for the gas as a flux. It can weld itself to the metal by touching.
1/2" to start the weld is OK but try to move the tip in closer once you have the pool formed so the gas can work properly. I try to stay at about 1/4"

bowtie · Secretary

I think the collar on the outside of the gun is too far out (or the liner the wire comes out of is too far in) 1/4" isn't possible, but I can figure that out I'm sure. I'm happy enough with how they turned out. Short of pulling one off to check, I do know that I can see the heat marks on the back side of the angle iron (2").

Dave Seitz · Mega Poster

On your gloves DO NOT pick up hot parts with them, you can get away with it a few times then you scorch the fingers and they harden ruining the feel. Get a few hunks of copper pipes and pound flat spots on the ends in a spoon type fashion. With short and longer lengths you can use it as a backer on holes to fill spot welding. Extra tips and another roll of wire and Nozzle spray next run to welding supply. Look at what wire you have now and type, stay with small diameter wire. The wire feed wheel on the machine needs to be reset when you change diameter of wire. If the feed wheel is set up for larger wire it will not feed correctly when you use a smaller wire. The liner and end of gun area has a small bit of adjustment available be carefull. Bench time makes you a better welder and learning your machine will only go so far. After you have the world by the tail with that machine and you try the new machines you will be looking at the new stuff. Happens all of the time and after running some of the new Miller welders I was real unhappy with mine.

Lost in the 60s · President

bowtie wrote:
I think the collar on the outside of the gun is too far out (or the liner the wire comes out of is too far in) 1/4" isn't possible, but I can figure that out I'm sure. I'm happy enough with how they turned out. Short of pulling one off to check, I do know that I can see the heat marks on the back side of the angle iron (2").

The collar should be longer than the tip that the wire comes out of. At least 1/8th inch. That setback is part of the gas shield "field". Keep the collar 1/4" from the work surface and you'll be good. Always PUSH a mig, not pull it like a stick. By holding the gun at a slight angle to see the work, the gas flows out ahead and pulling the weld instead of pushing it will let the pool run out of the field.

Seeing the heat marks on the back is good, but it should also look like the metal was at the point of melting there to, not just a hot spot.

Chris R · 2K+ Club

I think I get a pretty good discount on welders being a student a Dunwoody. I remember last year around this time when we went through the acetylene welding training. I talked to the welding instructor over there and he gave me the number to the rep whom deals with thier welding equipment. I never called the guy since I just dont have the money right now. But it would be foolish not to take advantage of it. Student loan company is taking advantage of getting thier share of intrest off me. Might as well take advantage of some discounts on my end too then.

I may start putting away some money this summer and next fall and see if I can get a nice TIG. Ive already got a nice Millermatic 212. Might as well grab some tools while the gettings good. I probably wont find my self in tech school like this again. God knows I took advantage of it while I was in school for automotive. Come to think of it, I still need to lease a tank of shielding gas as well. Probably better check into that too.

John D · 2K+ Club

One of the tests for penetration is to saw through the "test coupon" and look at the cross-section. There should be no voids, buggers, etc. - solid metal.

bowtie · Secretary

I took a couple of my test pieces and pulled them apart. That was test #1, then I did use a cut off tool on the ones that didn't break loose or look bad, seemed to be pretty good. I'll be making some coupons from scrap when I get a chance for more practice.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Bryan, are you doing this just to learn how to weld, or is there a specific project in the future...?

bowtie · Secretary

I had to weld stake pockets on my new trailer, but I got the welder from Chris P just after the Toll welding meeting last year. Never even plugged it in or hooked the tank up until last Friday. There are a few things I would like to do, but nothing else in particular at this point.

John D · 2K+ Club

So, did you buy a trailer "kit", or a pre-fab???