Discussion Forum - Northstar Chevelle Club

67ss · 1K+ Club

RE: Into the CAC-Dash/Gauge refurb, carpet/soundproofing, AC, who knows what else...

SShink · 3K+ Club

67ss wrote:
Is that corvette oil gauge mechanical or electric?

I think it's mechanical. If not, I'll have to find a sender that works with it.

SShink · 3K+ Club

SShink wrote:
67ss wrote:
Is that corvette oil gauge mechanical or electric?
I think it's mechanical. If not, I'll have to find a sender that works with it.

Confirmed, it's ELECTRICAL, which is fine since I already have an electrical oil sensor installed, but wasn't using it, and it should make the installation onto the gauge panel easier.

67ss · 1K+ Club

I was hoping it was as it would really suck to try and tighten a hard line to the back of it with the dash in the car. Plus no way it can leak either.

SShink · 3K+ Club

67ss wrote:
I was hoping it was as it would really suck to try and tighten a hard line to the back of it with the dash in the car. Plus no way it can leak either.

Well... apparantely Corvette's are as confusing as Chevelle's... I confirmed with the seller that it's a mechanical gauge. It went to electrical in '74. I may reconsider this one and order an electrical one for a '74 and sell the one I just bought. Anyone need an NOS oil gauge for a '72 vette?

Chris R · 2K+ Club

Here is one thats for sale that shows the same are in question under the radio. Bottom left photo.

http://desmoines.craigslist.org/pts/2778574463.html

dashboard · 2K+ Club

You can buy a resto new for $400.00

http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/fbshopmain2.asp?cat=0

SShink · 3K+ Club

Thanks guys, but I'll stay with the low budget route of a couple of PVC caps to repair the radio shaft holes, and that will work for me. I'm not going to replace the whole original dash just to have silver trim under the radio.

SteveS · Super Poster

Looks like this guy fixes them too, but shipping would be as much as the repairs.

http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=341312

dashboard · 2K+ Club

Interesting thread from TC, shows a repair to the same area in question on Stan’s and Mike’s dash.

Chris R · 2K+ Club

I just posted that so you could see another one that wasnt broken under the radio. For reference purposes.

Lost in the 60s · President

67ss wrote:
I was hoping it was as it would really suck to try and tighten a hard line to the back of it with the dash in the car. Plus no way it can leak either.

He could run a short line, say 12-14 inches from the gauge to install the dash and then use a coupling for the rest of the length to the engine.

Stan, I would be interested in the gauge if it was for a '70. Mine have that slight green tint.

You may still need to change the sender if the total pounds reading is different. The sender needs to match the gauge.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Lost in the 60s wrote:
Stan, I would be interested in the gauge if it was for a '70. Mine have that slight green tint.
You may still need to change the sender if the total pounds reading is different. The sender needs to match the gauge.

Mitch, the oil gauge has white numbers since it's for a '72.

I do have the '70 green face non-working clock that I'm taking out that I'm interested in getting rid of.

Lost in the 60s · President

SShink wrote:
Lost in the 60s wrote:
Stan, I would be interested in the gauge if it was for a '70. Mine have that slight green tint.
You may still need to change the sender if the total pounds reading is different. The sender needs to match the gauge.

Mitch, the oil gauge has white numbers since it's for a '72.
I do have the '70 green face non-working clock that I'm taking out that I'm interested in getting rid of.
Hmmmmm............ mine is a clock delete. I might be interested...

Chris R · 2K+ Club

Mitch. If your car was originally a console equipped car. Its supposed to be that way, clock got moved from the speedo to the console when you opted for a console and buckets back then.

SShink · 3K+ Club

DEEEEEEP into the CAC now. Gearlube and Dashboard stopped over and helped me disassemble even more today. Got the rear axle out and the gauge package disassembled.

Discovered an axle seal hemorraging lube into the rear brake, so this is perfect timing to replace the seals. Did figure out that the axle is out of a '72 LS5 Chevelle though by decoding the casting number!

Will need to do some cleaning up and rattle canning where the axle is, blast and paint the upper axle control arms, and replace the rubber gas lines by the tank. Also need to replace the bushings in the axle and upper control arms.

I think this is as far as the disassembly will go, but who knows what else I run into!

-- Edited by SShink on Saturday 4th of February 2012 04:07:58 PM

-- Edited by SShink on Saturday 4th of February 2012 04:10:49 PM

-- Edited by SShink on Saturday 4th of February 2012 04:12:22 PM

SShink · 3K+ Club

Chris R wrote:
Mitch. If your car was originally a console equipped car. Its supposed to be that way, clock got moved from the speedo to the console when you opted for a console and buckets back then.

He's talking about his '70, not the '66.

John D · 2K+ Club

Oh yeah... you're Cac'in deep!

Like you said, a perfect time to do axle seals, a brake rebuild, and the arms. Let me know when you're doing the arm bushings, I've got a bunch of semi-circle pieces made for pressing in new ones using a bench vise.

SShink · 3K+ Club

John D wrote:
Oh yeah... you're Cac'in deep!

Like you said, a perfect time to do axle seals, a brake rebuild, and the arms. Let me know when you're doing the arm bushings, I've got a bunch of semi-circle pieces made for pressing in new ones using a bench vise.

Trust me John, I'll be scheduling some time at 'Johnnie's Garage' soon to blast the control arms, and then to press in the bushings like we did on the lowers last winter (assuming that's o.k. with you)!

Chris R · 2K+ Club

SShink wrote:
Chris R wrote:
Mitch. If your car was originally a console equipped car. Its supposed to be that way, clock got moved from the speedo to the console when you opted for a console and buckets back then.
He's talking about his '70, not the '66.

Thats right. I forgot all about the LS5 car he has.

Chris R · 2K+ Club

You should drop that tank down Stan and see if there is another build sheet up there. It looks like its never been out of the car before.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Chris R wrote:
You should drop that tank down Stan and see if there is another build sheet up there. It looks like its never been out of the car before.

I'm going to do that since there is almost an inch of thread on the inboard bolts, so I can drop it down and stick a mirror up in there to see. And... I'm probably going to pull it out anyway since like the axle, it's "only 4 more bolts....".

That gives me a chance to clean up the tank inside and out, replace the tank sock, rubber hose lines, and the underside of the car at least up to in front of the axle.

Again, another part of the project scope creep! I guess I'm !

SShink · 3K+ Club

Clocks R Us today. Got the new '72 quartz converted clock!

Here's a comparison, kinda hard to tell but the '70 green face is on the right,, and the '72 white face is on the left:

And installed in the gauge pack:

I hooked up 12 volts to it and it keeps time! It will be strange the first time I drive the car and see that second hand moving!

SShink · 3K+ Club

Thanks to Steve S. leading the way, we got the 4.10 gears out and replaced them with 3.42's today! Of course, we had to fight axle tube repair bearings that wouldn't allow the axle to go in far enough to remove the C clip, bearings that wouldn't pull off the posi diff, and the usual things we run into when working on things that weren't done the right way before.

The disassembly took the longest, then the reassembly went much smoother with only needing to pull the diff a few times to change the backlash to make it right. The tooth pattern was spot on the first try thanks to Steve!

Now I need to clean it up, paint it, replace all the brake parts since they are grease soaked from the leaking seals, and get it back under the car.

Thanks again Steve for being so well prepared and knowing your way around a 12 bolt!

Here's the old gear on the posi:

The open pumpkin:

You can see the axle tube repair bearing sticking out in this view:

The axle tube bearing removed:

Gutted:

New bearing and seal installed:

Tooth patterns:

And the new gears installed:

The CAC counter is under 90 days and I got to get going!

-- Edited by SShink on Sunday 12th of February 2012 07:37:10 PM

Lost in the 60s · President

Wow, someone who knows how to set up gears in the club. He could probably make a side living on that.

Hope you plan to replace the wheel cylinders too. New shoes and hardware kits will beg for the old ones to start leaking soon after assembly...

Let me know what you need for the '70 clock and if I decide to go that route, we can exchange goods at the meeting next Sat.

SteveS · Super Poster

Everything worked out pretty well, it's always the easy stuff that ends up being a challenge. I'm going to weld up a fixture for my press for removing carrier bearings, that will make life easier next time. Thanks again for lunch, I can wait to see how the gears work for you.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Lost in the 60s wrote:
Wow, someone who knows how to set up gears in the club. He could probably make a side living on that.
Hope you plan to replace the wheel cylinders too. New shoes and hardware kits will beg for the old ones to start leaking soon after assembly...
Let me know what you need for the '70 clock and if I decide to go that route, we can exchange goods at the meeting next Sat.

Mitch,

Steve had 'special' tools fabbed up to make it easier, so he's done this a few times. I was impressed.

Yep, I'm going through the rear brakes completely and replacing everything. It's cheap insurance and easy to do.

I PM'd you on the clock.

Thanks.

John D · 2K+ Club

There are a few more parts ready for you at my place. Took a 1/2 day today for a Dr.'s appt., So after I got home I knocked 'em out.

SShink · 3K+ Club

John D wrote:
There are a few more parts ready for you at my place. Took a 1/2 day today for a Dr.'s appt., So after I got home I knocked 'em out.

Thanks John!

SShink · 3K+ Club

Well, the cave went from smelling like gear lube to paint today. Got the 12 bolt cleaned up & partially painted (waiting for the paint to cure to roll it on the stands), primed the upper control and anti-hop bars, and painted the brake drums. Interesting thing on the brake drums, they are aluminum, not cast iron. I've never run into that before. My buddy at O'Reilly's noticed that when I took them for a facing on the drum. I double checked with a magnet, and sure enuf, they are aluminum. I guess the lack of weight can't hurt.

12 Bolt before:

After:

Cleaned up what I think is a factory posi tag. I thought it was metal, but it's plastic:

Upper control arms, drums, and anti-hop bars:

Aslo got the gauges back together for bench testing this week. I re-installed the amp gauge for testing until I figure out the oil gauge replacement:

-- Edited by SShink on Sunday 19th of February 2012 09:44:04 PM

Tim H · Mega Poster

Dude you must really be going through a lot of buffing compound with all the buff and shine you are doing.

I can't believe you guys and painting in your shops, doesn't that make a mess? You would never catch me making a mess like that in my place

Looking good Stan.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Tim H wrote:
I can't believe you guys and painting in your shops, doesn't that make a mess? You would never catch me making a mess like that in my place

Hey Pops, I think it was smelling the fumes in your garage that made me do all that yesterday!

Gear Lube will be happy with me that I did put the car cover on the Chevelle to prevent overspray from falling on it so that he doesn't feel it the next time he puts his hands all over the Chevelle (just teasin' GL)!

SShink · 3K+ Club

Went to APT Instruments in Bloomington over lunch, and they bench tested the gauges. All is good other than the tach, which explains why there was an aftermarket one on the steering column. So, they are giving me a repair estimate, and I'll check aftermarket ones for price comparison. They also said they could work on the electronics to accept any type of tach input whether points or HEI disty. I'm using HEI, so they will keep that in mind.

I did learn something from them though... when I brought the cluster in I had it in a box with the faces down to protect the circuit board. They said to never lay them face down as there is some kind of needle dampening goo that was used in the 70's that can run out and the needle will bang on either end when voltage is applied. The tech told me the fuel and temp gauges appeared to have already had that happen to them. There's just too many things to know about these cars!

APTI is a cool place. It's in what used to be a garage tied to a home. They looked busier than heck, and when I was there they were quoting a job in Singapore! There were lots of cool gauges lying around waiting to be worked on. It's a family run business, and I think they had 6 or 7 people working there including 'Mom'. Nice to see a niche business surviving these days.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Well... now the cave smells like gear lube, paint, and now gasoline... Dropped the tank, but no build sheet. Kind of a disappointment since I was pretty sure there would be one. It doesn't look like the tank has ever been out as the area above it is still the underbody color. Oh well...

Bought a new tank, straps, sending unit, tank cushions, and hardware today from Auto City Classics. They gave me the 'Northstar' discount, so the tank was only $99!

Now I can do some basic cleanup and shoot the underbody with some fresh black paint, then install the rear end. Hopefully this weekend.

Here's the tank dropped down:

Oh, and had to remove the tail pipes too of course, and drain almost 10 gallons of gas. When I put it in storage, this wasn't part of the plan...

Chris R · 2K+ Club

Might as well burn that 10 gallons of gas in your pickup and put in fresh stuff in the spring. What condition are those lines in?

SShink · 3K+ Club

Chris R wrote:
Might as well burn that 10 gallons of gas in your pickup and put in fresh stuff in the spring. What condition are those lines in?

I may do that Chris. Although, it is non-oxy with sta-bil already in it from last Fall when I put it to sleep for the winter.

The steel lines are a little crudded up, but the ends are fine. I'm going to wire wheel them and shoot some paint on for protection. Of course, I'll replace all the rubber lines.

dashboard · 2K+ Club

Cave Man, you are moving into the “who knows what else…” part of your project. I see you did take the exhaust pipes off…….it’s morphing, transmuting, snowballing; it’s turning into “what else”.

Do as Chris suggests, put the fuel in your truck. Next spring put two five gallon cans of gas in checking your fuel gauge as you go, do a little in the field calibration.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Kevin, I sure have a lot more access to those upper control arm pockets now with everything out!

Good idea on calibrating with new fuel so that I can check the new sending unit. I'm surprised the old one worked with all the rust around/under the grounding wire lug on the chassis...

Tim H · Mega Poster

Are you saying your Chevelle is not the center of your universe!

-- Edited by Tim H on Wednesday 22nd of February 2012 06:45:17 AM

Chris R · 2K+ Club

I cant remember. How many gallons do these cars hold. Its like 16 or 17 I think. I see where Kevin's head is at. Take known amounts of gas and fill it while checking the gauge to see where it sits.

I like the idea of putting a gallon in and checking the gauge. Then you know where the gauge is at when your on the road and know exactly when its time to get gas. Also measure out half the tanks capacity and fill it up and see if your gauge reads half tank full. I think if someone wanted to fine tune thier gauge and sender to work exactly together on how much fuel you have in the tank. APT can make the proper adjustments, that is if you really wanted to know exactly. For me, if im getting close to E, I just head to the gas station.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Chris R wrote:
I cant remember. How many gallons do these cars hold. Its like 16 or 17 I think. I see where Kevin's head is at. Take known amounts of gas and fill it while checking the gauge to see where it sits.
I like the idea of putting a gallon in and checking the gauge. Then you know where the gauge is at when your on the road and know exactly when its time to get gas. Also measure out half the tanks capacity and fill it up and see if your gauge reads half tank full. I think if someone wanted to fine tune thier gauge and sender to work exactly together on how much fuel you have in the tank. APT can make the proper adjustments, that is if you really wanted to know exactly. For me, if im getting close to E, I just head to the gas station.

The coupe tank holds 20 gallons.

I usually start getting nervous when my gauge gets to 1/4 full, as that's when I head for the gas station. Hopefully it won't be as frequently with the new 3.42 gears instead of the 4.10's!

John D · 2K+ Club

It's creeping....

SShink · 3K+ Club

John D wrote:
It's creeping....

Like Kudzu during a hot summer in the South!!!

List of possible other 'creeps': 1.) Have the headliner replaced while the interior is out since it's from a '70 & is missing the dome light, 2.) Drop the rest of the exhaust and buff-n-shine the rest of the chassis since the back half will be done, 3.) New 3 point seat belts since the safety officer thinks I need them , 4.) Replace the exhaust while it's down, and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on.... None of which is going to happen due to running out of money and my wife starting to think the Chevelle is the center of my universe!

SteveS · Super Poster

Sure would be easier to work on all those projects if you had the body on a rotisserie.

SShink · 3K+ Club

SteveS wrote:
Sure would be easier to work on all those projects if you had the body on a rotisserie.

Or on a lift!

As a member of NCC, I think it's in the by-laws somewhere in the fine print that Chevelles are the center of our universe, but I haven't let the wife read that part yet!

Lost in the 60s · President

If the gauge doesn't read 1/4 tank with 5 gallons, you can bend the float rod to get it closer. The PITA with that is you need to remove the tank again. My '66 has the sending unit on the front and I can remove it with 5 gallons in it...

-- Edited by Lost in the 60s on Wednesday 22nd of February 2012 05:48:50 PM

SShink · 3K+ Club

Mike (OscarZ), thanks again for saving me the miles by picking up the parts at ACC and meeting me at your work! You've paid it forward with me, so let me know when you need me to 'head up nordt'!

Along with the new tank, it was great to see the ring and gasket with the new tank ring, and the hardware that came with the straps! Hopefully that new tank won't be riding around in the bed of my truck too long!

SShink · 3K+ Club

Lost in the 60s wrote:
If the gauge doesn't read 1/4 tank with 5 gallons, you can bend the float rod to get it closer. The PITA with that is you need to remove the tank again. My '66 has the sending unit on the front and I can remove it with 5 gallons in it...

-- Edited by Lost in the 60s on Wednesday 22nd of February 2012 05:48:50 PM

But... it drops a whole lot easier with new un-rusted hardware, fresh rubber lines, and only 5 gallons instead of 10!

dashboard · 2K+ Club

Keep in mind these fuel quantity indicating gauges where not designed to represent precisely how much fuel is in the tank. They are designed to become more accurate as the fuel level decreases towards zero.

Adding five gallons at a time allows you to calibrate your dipstick.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Got the worst part of working under the floor pans done today! Cleaned up and painted the frame rails, floor pans, inside of the fender wells, etc. and got them all painted. Man I hate laying on the floor with crap falling in my face, then wearing a mask and coveralls when painting. My wife thought somebody beat me up when she saw my face with all the black overspray on it! And that was with wearing a mask and safety glasses. Talk about a racoon look!

I do have to say I'm very happy about how solid the floor and trunk pans are. There was very little surface rust, and above the tank was like just out of the factory.

Also got one side of the brakes done. I'd forgotten how fun drum brakes are to hold half of it together while getting the springs on... I used John D.'s brake tools, and that helped a lot. Thanks John!

I hope to get the other side brakes done this week, then I can get the new gas tank in, tail pipes back on, and get the axle back under it this weekend. Then I can move back into the interior.

Here's some before's: